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December 11, 2011

9

God isn’t a very good communicator.

by juju2112

A couple days ago, this news story came across my feed:

A sad day for the Duggar family.  Michelle Duggar has miscarried in the second trimester of pregnancy for her 20th child.
According to People magazine, Michelle Duggar was at a routine check-up to find out the sex of her child, but the doctor could not find a heartbeat.

It’s an incredibly sad story; a tragedy that no sane person would wish on anyone. It also brings to light some interesting questions, though, such as: What would motivate someone to try to have 20 children? The answer: Religion. Once again, religion is causing people to make poor decisions.

More interestingly, most of the comments on the KNWA Facebook page were totally bizarre and make me feel like an alien in this part of the country.

God is telling her to STOP!

Well, maybe god is sending them a message – to STOP having any more kids !!

Maybe this is a sign for them. It is very sad but with what happened last birth and now, maybe God is sending them a message.

Stop having kids that’s your sign

What I find amazing about this viewpoint is that it wasn’t just one person’s opinion. Several different people proposed that God actually sends messages to people by killing their children. Why would someone worship a God that does this? I don’t get how people can say that God killed a child to send a message in one breath, and then say they’re praying to that God in the next. Don’t they realize they’re worshipping a monster?

Even if God didn’t deliberately kill the child, he still allowed it to happen through his own inaction. He’s omnipotent, after all! If God exists, he could have stopped this and he didn’t. That’s pretty despicable in my view.

But of course, the reason this viewpoint is so popular is that any unusual thing that happens automatically gets credited to God. That’s how people build their imaginary towers of evidence in their minds. When you’re living a fantasy, everything that happens to you gets woven into that imaginary world. Found a penny on the ground? Praise God! Won a free Coke? What a blessing! If you’ve got a favorite answer, it’s all too easy to weave it in as an explanation to everything.

From the same Facebook thread, we have the stock answer in this fantasy to the “God is Evil” accusation:

So sad but we must rejoice even in the darkest of times because God has a plan for everything… Prayers to her and her family.

Oh really? God has a plan, eh? We’re just too stupid to know what it is. What plan would justify letting a child die? The guy’s supposed to be all-powerful! Is this really the best he can do? And why would you keep praying to a being that obviously can’t (or won’t) stop bad things from happening? He doesn’t seem that powerful if he can’t prevent child death.

Then, we have the people that want me to shut up.

if you don’t understand then let it be. You have your own beliefs and they have theirs. Its ok if you don’t understand why they put their faith in a god that takes and gives all the same, i can’t explain it because i don’t believe in it either. But its no reason to go and bash someone elses religion. I respect and understand your opinion, but is this really the right place to make it known? The family just lost a child, no matter your beliefs that’s something no one should suffer through, try to show a little compassion please?

That is a horrible sad thing, the lost of any child and all these uncompanionate people need to keep their mouth shut. God uses all things and works them for the good to those who love him. This baby was created by God as all Babies are and it doesn’t matter how many you have they are all important and loved by God.

I have two things to say: 1) If you have never lost a child, you need to shut your hole; 2) Quit wasting so much time gossiping about a couple that love each other and happen to be fertile. If you don’t like them, don’t read about them or watch their show.

Yes, yes this is absolutely the right time and place to discuss religion. Here, we have an excellent example of religion guiding people towards making stupid decisions. Why is it that whenever there’s a tragedy brought on by religion, people try to say that it’s not the “right time and place” to criticize it? I find that awful convenient. Funny how the praise towards God flows fast and furious in those same stories. Religion loves to swoop in and prey on the weak in times of tragedy. Try to question it, though, and WHOAH, you’re an asshole. It’s quite the double-standard.

I’m sure people would love to hear me question religion when it doesn’t matter, when it’s not hurting people. Then they can pull the “What do you care? It’s not hurting anybody!” card. Frankly, I find this shut up mentality to be chilling. Open, honest discussion is needed, especially on subjects that guide people’s life decisions.

When they’re not telling me to shut up, they’re comparing me to mass-murdering communists:

Of course the ones with the most blood on their hands have been atheists. Communist governments have killed more people than any type of government ever in the history of mankind. They also did it in the shortest amount of time.

Here, we have someone from my own community echoing the popular sentiment that I am morally bereft and likely to commit mass-murder. The guy doesn’t even know me, so he has nothing to stand on except his own prejudice and bigotry. This isn’t an isolated incident, either. I have been told many times that I can’t have any morals because I’m an atheist. I think if people would just get to know me, they’d find that this isn’t the case. In the meantime, this is just one other method believers use to silence criticism.

 

 

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9 Comments Post a comment
  1. Dec 11 2011

    Hitler thought that he was doing the Lord’s work. So did Paul (the deciple) who was playing Jewish Genocide long before Hitler discovered it. Of course there was also the Inquisition, Jihads, the Crusades, etc…yeah…I see their point. Only the godless mass-murder. Hehehe,

    Reply
  2. tobeforgiven
    Dec 11 2011

    Your final arguement is one that Christians do often make. The point of this arguement is most often in response to that arguement being used against Christians. Most often we point out this fact because it shows that people do stupid things because of their humanity, not becuase of their religious or non religious beliefs. People pick and choose, twist and magle, which ever religion, philosophy, or theory that will fit them. Read Hitler’s table talks, and you will be utterly confused about the religion/philosophy/socio/scientific theory he created to fit his own evils. This could also be said of Leonard Darwin and the eugenics movement. They created a twisting of Darwins theories to fit their own biggoted philosophy. Christianity has faced the same when you examine the attrocities committed in the name of Jesus. As Christ never taught in any way that people should commit attrocities, this is always a twisting of what is true.
    This is caused by our human nature not our religious or non religious nature.
    To point out the fact that Atheists have killed more (though this would be hard to prove, it can be said that Atheists have killed) should be taken as proof that people do evil things no matter what they believe or dont believe.
    In this case I am not sure what you are blaming on religion. I have not yet found the link between having 20 kids and religion. I do however, somewhat see your concern about the comments that people left.
    However, would you not tell this person that their body was giving them a sign that it was time to stop having children? How is this better or worse?

    Reply
    • Dec 11 2011

      I can answer the question of the link (in THIS case) between religion & 20 kids.

      The Duggars are part of a branch of dominionist christianity with “quiverful” leanings – meaning, they see their *purpose* as to have as many babies as possible toward the work of god…in the name of christianity. That is the link being noted here.

    • juju2112
      Dec 11 2011

      Right. They’ve specifically said that they’re letting God decide how many children they should have. Their religion has guided this decision to have 20 children. It’s directly responsible.

    • juju2112
      Dec 11 2011

      In the examples that are typically cited, men have killed because of political reasons. People don’t kill others because they don’t believe in God.

      People DO kill people because of their belief in God, though. It doesn’t go both ways.

  3. Dec 11 2011

    *ponders carefully before responding*

    I agree that this is the perfect *time* to discuss the matter. What I have heartburn about isn’t the *time*…it’s the direction.

    As a fellow atheist, I whole-heartedly agree with what you’ve pointed out here. I do, however, take issue with believers’ statements about “god’s plan” — and nonbelievers’ mockery of the same.

    The *discussion* is necessary NOW. However, the directed commentary TO the Duggar family is inappropriate at this time. That’s where I draw the line. I have refused to take part in any debate — not because of any perceived double-standard (and it DOES exist, I agree), but because much of it is being directed squarely AT Michelle Duggar and her husband. To me, that is the equivalent of kicking someone when they’re down…and that is cruelty in action.

    A public discussion *generalized*? Sure. A directed discussion at this point? I’m not keen on it. I say this from the position of someone who has had 3 successful pregnancies (and only 3 pregnancies total, so far as I’m aware), as a friend and family member to women who have had multiple miscarriages and having witnessed the enormous heartbreak involved, and as a former (100% successful with multiple live births each) egg donor to help women have much-desired families (and I’ve been criticized by “christians” for that, too).

    My concern and wariness isn’t the *what*…it’s the *how*…and more specifically, how it’s *directed*…if that makes sense.

    Reply
    • juju2112
      Dec 11 2011

      I can sort of understand that. I don’t feel like I’m attacking them personally, though. Just the ideas around their decisions. I’m sure they’re very nice people who deserve the very best in life.

  4. Dec 12 2011

    I dont think this guy understands anything about Christianity at all.

    Reply
    • juju2112
      Dec 12 2011

      Can you elaborate, or cite a specific point in which I am wrong? This sort of comment doesn’t help me.

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